solar energy

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solar energy

Postby sjeng » Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:18 pm

is there any experience with solar energy,
i am looking for information about solar systems via battery or a direct to the grit system i am wondering if its profitable already to install some panels i am thinking about a system mounted on the roof with a capacity of 1000 -2000 w.
any experience , dealers , brand, QUALITY aso
i think most panels come from china now a days but do they also last for 25 year???
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Re: solar energy

Postby geordie » Sun Jun 10, 2012 5:12 am

there have been several discusions regarding solar some for some against the against is the returns unless you ""need"" its not going to show a return the panels lose efficiency the batterys need regular replacement the inverter the same if you are on the grid the cost is lower you can make savings better by converting the house led bulbs being a huge cost saving
using less is better :mrgreen:
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Re: solar energy

Postby sjeng » Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:48 am

installationcosts are going down a lot the last few years
in europe its prfitable after 10 years (break even point). with an estimated lifetime of 25 year

electric power costs are going up.

complete set in europ 1.9 kw costs about 3500 euro (diy) thb 140.000 and direct to the grit incl inverter, no batteries needed.
set prices in thailand might be significant lower.

i am not sure what is the kw price for electric we pay have to look on the next bill at the end of the month.

when you safe 14.000 thb a year break even in 10 year.
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Re: solar energy

Postby Maseratimartin » Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:33 am

I'm not sure that the sets are cheaper in LOS....think more about 100% more (customs)!

The PVC window companies down in Pattaya who work with imported profiles mostly also offer solar systems.
Unfortunately their info on the web is not very detailed.

I actually plan also to go this road...but not this year.
(deleted comercial link as company now not operating and not allowed by forum rules. mod)
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Re: solar energy

Postby Nawty » Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:22 pm

I made a decision to go down this track also when we eventually the next house....not for need to save on electric costs, but to do something and build the house as enviro neutral as possible.....we only have this one planet and it is being screwed way to much by everything else.

We could easily say...but yeah, we are just one household and meanwhile Somchai up the road has just wasted all that I have saved....but you need to start somewhere somehow.
conwood is not real wood.....break it down 'con' to deceive...'wood'
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Re: solar energy

Postby geordie » Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:33 pm

Try and find the info on the amount of energy used to costruct a solar panel in the first place i am told its more than you can recover carbon wise ??
my comments may be wrong but never deliberately
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Re: solar energy

Postby canopy » Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:46 am

I looked at off grid several years ago for a small house with tiny electrical usage, not even enough power to pull one air conditioner. Batteries cost 300,000+ baht from Thai companies. The batteries are good for up to 3 years, maybe less and then hundreds of pounds of batteries need tossed in the trash and new ones purchased. That sure is a lot of waste and cost. So as far as I can see for off grid you aint savin money and you aint savin the environment. The grid carries every single advantage: reliability, price, environmentally friendliness, ease of maintenance, expand-ability, everything.

My visits to Thai companies showed solar equipment is extremely expensive here and like other things they have the mindset that they need to raise the prices every year. Cost of small (10Kwh) system is a million or two baht not including installation, tools, or mounting accessories. Look to import from China to cut out the stealers reselling the equipment here. But it should be obvious there is absolutely no pay off down the line with off grid since grid power is 3 baht a Kwh.
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Re: solar energy

Postby fredlk » Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:51 am

I would have loved to have used solar, but here it is only really viable for heating water and as I use a minimal amount, even that system was not worth the expense.
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Re: solar energy

Postby Roger Ramjet » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:51 am

It's an interesting topic because I thought Australia would use the Great Sandy Desert and The Artesian Basin to supply 90% of Australian's need of electricity with solar arrays. However currently only just over 3% of Australia uses solar energy and instead they are going down the track of carbon tax credits, which means that consecutive governments are not listening, for thousands of reasons, too long to write about here.
Here's a cost list of the different systems they do sell in Australia: http://www.solarpoweraustralia.com.au/p ... deals.html
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Re: solar energy

Postby sjeng » Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:28 am

geordie
you should not believe everything they tell you.

the one who told you might like nuclear power instead solar energy, or they are shareholders of a big firm like SO, SHELL, BP



geordie wrote:Try and find the info on the amount of energy used to costruct a solar panel in the first place i am told its more than you can recover carbon wise ??
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Re: solar energy

Postby geordie » Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:44 pm

sjeng wrote:geordie
you should not believe everything they tell you.

the one who told you might like nuclear power instead solar energy, or they are shareholders of a big firm like SO, SHELL, BP



geordie wrote: i am told its more than you can recover carbon wise ??


i did not say i beleived entirely ?? but the stuff like anything has to be made and questions have been suggested the batteries ?? at least nowadays are recycled rather than land fill the inverter ""probably the same!! but even reproccessing takes energy creates carbon personnally i laughed at my son who claimed enough growth = grass trees ect in his garden to make his meagre usage carbon neutral he uses led bubs low energy apliance,s turns everything off not in use even a phone charger is removed from the socket if not in use now i justify my usage as 12 rai of trees :roll: :roll: and minimising usage (eventually)but my challenge still stands i will pay 10%above grid prices i will pay installation costs for anyone who wishes to fit solar on my house as long as they can supply my needs and i am not left for weeks without power while they wait for parts offseting against usage can be helpful to a degree reducing usage can be helpful even more But to go seriously down the road of being enviromentally freindly start looking at your build and how much carbon is created to manufacture AAC blocks =cooked in an oven Steel uses a fair amount of heat during manufacture as does copper / insulation glazed tiles all create carbon which cannot be recouped by a solar array on the roof but the array will make you feel better the goverment here (uk) subsidises the install as well as an inflated buy back figure for the grid they can also remove those subsidied anytime they want as they recently threatened to do causing installers and owners alike to go up in arms about how much money they would lose !!that says it all really!! I have one sone who lives in a four bedromm house one sone in a two bedroom flat one son with g :roll: f in a one bedroom The four bedroom house has the lowest energy usage ?? so with care you can help planting a s**t load of trees will minimise the damage its the loss of the trees causing a large part of it nawty has proved serious in his natural construction material not something all of us are prepared to do added to the amount of planting he did there he is probably compensating for previous carbon emissions as well
my comments may be wrong but never deliberately
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Re: solar energy

Postby Roger Ramjet » Mon Jun 11, 2012 6:40 pm

Geordie,
geordie wrote:i did not say i beleived entirely ??

How can you say such things? How can you burst the environmental bubble people live in? You'll flummox people here with all that slanderous talk. Next you'll be telling us acid rain won't damage tress and that trees actually stop flooding. I'm forgetting myself again, I'm in Thailand. Now here's a link that might cause the environmentalists to consider what they are actually saying and doing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzLebC0mjCQ
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Re: solar energy

Postby MGV12 » Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:08 pm

Here you go Geordie ... dip your bread in the dripping my son:

http://butnowyouknow.net/truth-vs-myth/ ... vironment/

“Some days I am an optimistic pessimist ... other days I am a pessimistic optimist”
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Re: solar energy

Postby sirineou » Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:08 pm

Roger Ramjet wrote:Geordie,
geordie wrote:i did not say i beleived entirely ??

How can you say such things? How can you burst the environmental bubble people live in? You'll flummox people here with all that slanderous talk. Next you'll be telling us acid rain won't damage tress and that trees actually stop flooding. I'm forgetting myself again, I'm in Thailand. Now here's a link that might cause the environmentalists to consider what they are actually saying and doing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzLebC0mjCQ


The Pen and Teller program is appropriately named "BS" because it is a a bunch of BS, and what is worst is that they Pen and Teller are intelligent enough to know what they are saying is BS, so they are greedy hypocrites.
Their goal in producing this show is to provide entertainment and in the process make some money, and propagate their libertarian agenda.

They use a propaganda devise called the "Straw man" where you develop a week opponent, only to easily defeat him.
This is dangerous, because it provides cover, for those who for what ever reason refuse to recycle.
I watched this clip waiting to hear why Recycling was a bad idea, and aside from some weak comedic pranks, in the end their only argument was that,it requires more energy to recycle something than to produce it from scratch.
This argument might be correct if recycling was only done to conserve energy,but we all know that there are many reasons why we recycle.
Recycling conserves,raw material for future use
protects the environment from the damage it creates during the extraction of new raw material
prevents the pollution, and associated problems to many to mention,that discarding such material in the environment would create .
ETC, etc......
There is a lot more I could say about this subject, but this thread is about Solar energy, on this subject I will say that Thailand is not where it needs to be, to make , solar energy a cost effective, energy solution, for the individual user.
As energy costs increase,with the inevitability of "Peak oil",and the price of solar energy components, decreases with the economy of scale, and If and when, they create a system, here in Thailand, where the end user can feed power back in to the grid, eliminating the need for individual battery storage.Then solar energy will be an effective way to combat costs and protect the environment, untill then, as others have said, there are other, more effective ways to save money and protect the environment.
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Re: solar energy

Postby geordie » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:32 pm

mgv12 thanks nice link :mrgreen: sirinou nicely put thailand actually discourages via taxation
economy of scale is a falacy its way overpriced to ever be produced with economy in mind
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