Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

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Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby marcas » Thu Mar 31, 2016 10:34 am

Does anybody have up to date info on the difference in cost per square metre, including render, between Superblock, Concrete block and small bricks?

Also, if you have used AAC (Super) blocks with glue for bedding. Did your walls crack afterwards?
I was talking with a friend who built houses in Australia for a long time and he said that when they introduced the blocks there, using the thin bed of glue to stick them, all the walls cracked, so later when using this type of block, they used a sand and cement mortar bed which didn't crack. This is only what I have been told!

I am starting a build and am torn with which material to use for the walls.....................please do not write about heat in the walls etc. I will use one skin and to me the small bricks will be the strongest by far. Those super blocks with a very thin screed on them will not be strong if bumped accidentally in my opinion.

All I am looking for here is the difference in cost.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby schuimpge » Thu Mar 31, 2016 10:45 am

Cracked walls is all about foundation.
With the building practice here, it's all concrete ring-beams and the blocks or bricks or anything else used are just infill.
If your ring-beams are good, then cracks are close to impossible with super-blocks and if it cracks, then you'd better get your foundations checked as the crack is just a pointer to something far more serious!
Been reading the building stories here on CTH for the last 4 years or so and have never heard of a cracked super-block wall!

If they cracked in Australia, then you'd have to check on what foundation-practices they used.

And bumping into any wall with enough mass and force will crack / damage a wall, but you're talking about a car or lift-truck to do that kind of damage after you've rendered the walls. Cracked walls are way more common here when using red brick & mortar. Aside from that, you need more luck finding a crew that does a proper job on it.

Read the threads of eye-catcher, sometimes woodworker and roger ramjet to find lots of details on the cost of it.
What you pay more for super-blocks, you more than make up with the time you save on construction, labour.

Good luck with your build..
Cheers,
Luc
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby Roger Ramjet » Thu Mar 31, 2016 11:14 am

marcas wrote:Also, if you have used AAC (Super) blocks with glue for bedding. Did your walls crack afterwards?
I was talking with a friend who built houses in Australia for a long time and he said that when they introduced the blocks there, using the thin bed of glue to stick them, all the walls cracked, so later when using this type of block, they used a sand and cement mortar bed which didn't crack. This is only what I have been told!

I used over 4,000 AAC superblock in my house and before rendering (3 month gap due to floods) there was absolutely no cracks in any of the walls. Later after rendering there appeared a number of small cracks, but that was due to the renderers not mixing in Lanko 751 when mixing the glue.
If you think about it, laying a sand and cement bed to glue the blocks to is the same as laying them on concrete. If the walls cracked they did something wrong. I'll bet you they were talking about the render cracking and not the blocks.
The Thai builder tried to talk me into laying the sand and cement mortar bed giving the same reasons.... the blocks would crack otherwise.... but if it's done properly they won't.....it turned out it was only his second effort laying AAC blocks and he'd listened to the previous Thai builder who'd told him "that's how it is done". It's not, you don't need to do that.
marcas wrote:I am starting a build and am torn with which material to use for the walls.....................please do not write about heat in the walls etc. I will use one skin and to me the small bricks will be the strongest by far. Those super blocks with a very thin screed on them will not be strong if bumped accidentally in my opinion.

If you look at Max and Bee in Chiang Mai's build viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1970 Max tested his red brick walls by shoulder charging them (Ex Victorian copper) and they didn't stand the shoulder test........but the AAC blocks did.
My builder's foreman put a wall in the pantry where it shouldn't have gone and had to jack hammer out the AAC block wall. Trust me AAC blocks are stronger than bloody red bricks. The red bricks here are baked at very low temperature to save money. If you have a look at a couple of builds that used them you'll see broken ones everywhere even after just being unloaded from the truck.
You can come and shoulder charge any of my AAC block walls any time, you won't knock them down even after just a few hours.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby marcas » Thu Mar 31, 2016 11:49 am

Hmmm,

So you used the glue for bedding the blocks and I presume there is some kind of very thin screed type solution to render the walls with v's up to 10 mm mortar?

Lanko 71?

The foundations are probably over strong, ie; 19 posts over 127m2 and quality steel too. Maybe it would hold another storey if need be in the future!
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby Sometimewoodworker » Thu Mar 31, 2016 12:23 pm

Depending on where you are in relation to the factory and how many you are getting it is possible to get below 15 baht for 7.5 cm AAC. though you are more likely to be paying something over 20.

When you look at the cost per bag of AAC glue it seems expensive compared to cement, but then look at how much of each you use and the glue becomes very cheap.

Then you factor in the speed of laying AAC, the insulation factor, and the dimensional accuracy and there is then no real contest.

The conclusion is that Brick and concrete blocks are more expensive.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby Roger Ramjet » Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:58 pm

marcas wrote:Hmmm,

So you used the glue for bedding the blocks and I presume there is some kind of very thin screed type solution to render the walls with v's up to 10 mm mortar?

Lanko 71?

If you are referring to what I wrote, you have me lost.....bedding the blocks, no, I glued them to my slab. If you look at Youtube you'll find many videos about AAC blocks and how they should be lade and if you look at a few builds you'll see they have been done correctly.
I used Lanko 751 as a bonding agent, you don't have to, but I did.
marcas wrote:The foundations are probably over strong, ie; 19 posts over 127m2 and quality steel too. Maybe it would hold another storey if need be in the future!

And if you are referring again to my build and had read it, you'd see right from the start it was designed to have a concrete roof as the house was designed for the Caribbean where they happen to have cyclones. My house also sits on what was once rice paddies, which means mud as the foundations. If you are referring to something else then it doesn't matter.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby Sometimewoodworker » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:32 pm

If you look at the last few pages of my build you can see the render process. Depending on the quality of the wall builders the render can be thin but usually isn't.

The structure of the render for my walls is a first coat of the AAC block render that is cheaper and rougher than the topcoat then a topcoat of the render in the green bags. Unfortunately our wall builders were not the best, but the render team is superb, true professionals who spend almost 1/4 to 1/3 of the time polishing the surface leaving a surface that is virtually paint ready.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby marcas » Sun Jul 03, 2016 3:29 pm

In the end, I went with the Q Con blocks 7.5 cm and used the Tiger brand render. Walls are very good and no cracks as yet. In some places the render was 40 mm + and i was pleased with the end result. I'm not sure about price, I think it was cheaper than using red brick and certainly cooler. If anybody needs any info, can supply costs etc.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby Roger Ramjet » Sun Jul 03, 2016 4:51 pm

marcas wrote:In the end, I went with the Q Con blocks 7.5 cm and used the Tiger brand render. Walls are very good and no cracks as yet. In some places the render was 40 mm + and i was pleased with the end result. I'm not sure about price, I think it was cheaper than using red brick and certainly cooler. If anybody needs any info, can supply costs etc.

I'm pleased you are happy with the result. I've always said it's cheaper than red bricks, except if you are doing double thickness with an air gap between the two walls.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby canopy » Sun Jul 03, 2016 8:51 pm

In some places the render was 40 mm

Wow, what a blunder. q-con render should be thin like 5mm, 7mm, or even a bit more especially if using multiple coats. 40mm is just way, way beyond what the render can be asked to do. Says so right on the bag.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby marcas » Thu Jul 07, 2016 12:10 pm

canopy wrote:In some places the render was 40 mm

Wow, what a blunder. q-con render should be thin like 5mm, 7mm, or even a bit more especially if using multiple coats. 40mm is just way, way beyond what the render can be asked to do. Says so right on the bag.


No s**t? I'll have a look at that. The displays I've seen in TW and other stores seem to have quite a thick render. I did question the thickness on that one wall, but we shall see what happens. So far there are no cracks anywhere. certainly on the outside walls, with changes in levels between walls and concrete ring beam etc, it would be impossible to make a 5 mm render.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby Andyfteeze » Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:04 pm

Concrete blocks and red bricks are a Cheap buy but you pay and pay and pay to keep your house cool after. I call them pizza ovens. When i see new houses going up with these materials, i call out "another pizza oven" going up. :D
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby Thai Dhupp » Sat Sep 03, 2016 9:18 pm

marcas wrote:In the end, I went with the Q Con blocks 7.5 cm and used the Tiger brand render. Walls are very good and no cracks as yet. In some places the render was 40 mm + and i was pleased with the end result. I'm not sure about price, I think it was cheaper than using red brick and certainly cooler. If anybody needs any info, can supply costs etc.


Hi Marcas... if possible, I would be interested in your costings - We will be starting build in Chonburi in the not too distant future, so Im collecting up to date info for the spreadsheet to try see what we might end up paying for our lil' slice of paradise!

Thanks in advance.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby marcas » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:08 pm

Thai Dhupp wrote:
marcas wrote:In the end, I went with the Q Con blocks 7.5 cm and used the Tiger brand render. Walls are very good and no cracks as yet. In some places the render was 40 mm + and i was pleased with the end result. I'm not sure about price, I think it was cheaper than using red brick and certainly cooler. If anybody needs any info, can supply costs etc.


Hi Marcas... if possible, I would be interested in your costings - We will be starting build in Chonburi in the not too distant future, so Im collecting up to date info for the spreadsheet to try see what we might end up paying for our lil' slice of paradise!

Thanks in advance.


Hi, sorry I've not been on here for a while as we finished our build. If you have not started yet, or if I could help you with anything, just ask.
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Re: Blocks v's blocks v's bricks?

Postby Thai Dhupp » Thu May 04, 2017 7:15 pm

marcas wrote:
Thai Dhupp wrote:
marcas wrote:In the end, I went with the Q Con blocks 7.5 cm and used the Tiger brand render. Walls are very good and no cracks as yet. In some places the render was 40 mm + and i was pleased with the end result. I'm not sure about price, I think it was cheaper than using red brick and certainly cooler. If anybody needs any info, can supply costs etc.


Hi Marcas... if possible, I would be interested in your costings - We will be starting build in Chonburi in the not too distant future, so Im collecting up to date info for the spreadsheet to try see what we might end up paying for our lil' slice of paradise!

Thanks in advance.


Hi, sorry I've not been on here for a while as we finished our build. If you have not started yet, or if I could help you with anything, just ask.


Hi again Marcas, thanks for the reply... I too have not been on here for some time and actually have started listing my build thread elsewhere ( i was thinking of simultaneously listing it across all the forums but I'm guessing that might not go down to well with moderators!). We have not yet started so no build pix as yet but this month we are doing the ground raising in readiness for the rainy season. Build will kick off, all being well in November-time.

thanks for the offer of help - appreciated. Im looking to update any costings to current figures, so any info you have in this respect is gratefully received. thanks in advance.
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