Costing for cabins

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Costing for cabins

Postby Cheeryble » Sun May 24, 2015 4:24 pm

Hi there

I had a design for a modest place for our hilltop site where I would spend my budget on the main build, but make the design so if things work out it can be extended easily afterwards.
I based my estimate per sqm on a couple of friends proven costs for several builds.
However getting the builders to give a satisfactory price this way, seemed to complicated for the brain.

Happily I've had a radical rethink which I actually prefer and is simplicity itself and where every square metre paid for will be used straight away.
Instead of paying for a huge balcony I can make a terrace directly on the earth between the two chalets.
May even make it from wood from Mum's house coming down.

Build consists merely of two chalets with a space in between which can have concrete or stones and maybe a little pond feature....but forget about that let's keep it simple.
I want to cost just the two chalets, and the finish? Shall we say resort style a bit economical but nothing not done properly and no squeaky windows.
I am thinking to cost the materials then can add an appropriate amount for labour.

I'm not sure what the foundation pads' size will be as it's is lightweight block with very lightweight sheet metal roof. Suggestions?
It will have an unpainted finish inside and out but polished concrete cut mun.
the roof will be colour bond or other metal sheet at a minimum ante and trimmed properly at the sides to look nice.
The interior walls and floor will also be cut mun may have a few decorative tiles embedded but forget them let's stick to the basic costs.

I want to work out if i can indeed keep in my budget (which i will hold to myself for now to not influence answers :-))

The building A is 7m x 4m including shower room 2m x 2m
Building B is 6.5 x 3.5m, including the kitchen at 3.5m x 2m and the shower room at 1.8m x 1.6m

Take a look at a sketch:

FullSizeRender.jpg


FullSizeRender.jpg


CONCRETE
Foundation Pads/Columns to 2.5m above ground (x12)

Beams linking columns (50m)

Floor (cut mun polished concrete) 64m2

Walls (7.5cm thermalite blocks plus special mortar) x 132.5m2

Polished concrete finish to walls 2 sides total 265m2

Roof (Colourbond with insulation and foil) x 101m2

Plasterboard ceiling and fittings supplied and painted white x 50m2

Windows
Sliding doors 3.6m wide and 2m wide...total including windows about 20m2.....reasonable quality black aluminium

Doors two to bathrooms and one exterior to kitchen

Two bathroom sets one pretty good quality one more economy but OK. Washbasin, toilet, shower, taps.

Piping and fittings

Kitchen:
Basin and taps.

Electrics: Generous number of power points in all areas. Possibly Chang brand which I believe is good but economical.

Counters:
Both studio rooms will have "open shelving/wardrobes" of 4inch thick concrete shelving/up-stands around the area outside the bathroom as shown. may be doubled or tripled as shelving.
Kitchen will also have single counter along one side and shelf below
Total of horizontal counter and up stands approx 44m.

If anyone can suggest prices for any of these elements I'd be very grateful and we can build up a cost.
No doubt I have forgotten a few bits which can be added.
I already have an idea of some things and will start of with windows.
Can i get decent windows/sliding doors for 1750/m2 for a total of 35,000?

Thanks
Cheeryble
 
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Cheeryble » Mon May 25, 2015 3:12 pm

OK here's a start:

Windows:
my estimate for windows seems reasonable.
I went into a place here in CR where a very civilised English speaking young man told me I should expect to pay 1800/sqm for windows/sliding doors.
(Is there any premium for black frames?

Walls:
I think i saw 75mm thermalite blocks advertised for 16 baht each.
as they are 200x600mm = 0.12sqm a block that would mean 8.33 to a sqm.
Say 8.5 as probably very little wastage.
8.5 x 16 = 136baht/sqm
How much to add for lightweight block adhesive?

Walls:
Polished cement finish to walls.
I saw a figure of 80bt/sqm/side.
Sound OK?

Roof:
Seem to remember 500bt/sqm for colour bond.
If this is correct how much should I add for spanning the 4m width of the room and supporting the roof....and for trim on the sides and underneath at the sides?

Bathroom set:
Basin: 1200
Taps: 800
Toilet: 3000
Shower and mixer: 4000
low level cock: 120
Mirror: 3000

Additions, amendments, and criticisms welcome!
Cheeryble
 
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Cheeryble » Mon May 25, 2015 5:48 pm

On reflection when it comes to the floor it has to be laid on something.

Either they raise the earth level or have to lay concrete floor support slabs and screed.
Does the effort of filling with say a foot or a foot and a half of earth make it worth paying for support slabs?
(and should i have the wall support beams set into the earth to keep it all as low as possible commensurate with keeping the walls at least a bit above any water level?)
In any case it's going to have to be allowed for and added to the cost.

Guessing the actual screeding will be thicker than a wall screed and if direct on earth will need some light rebar or have seen it done with bamboo.
Cheeryble
 
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Roger Ramjet » Mon May 25, 2015 6:34 pm

Cheeryble wrote:Guessing the actual screeding will be thicker than a wall screed and if direct on earth will need some light rebar or have seen it done with bamboo.

Yesterday I was at Thai Watsadu Bang Bua Thong and noticed they now have three different types of "demountables" for sale. I didn't stop and get the details, but I can this weekend if you like.
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Klondyke » Mon May 25, 2015 8:04 pm

For such a simple house I would not do beams (sau - as usually in Thailand) but double block (or brick) wall that is selfstanding and what the best - is well insulating. If you do it by the cement blocks (40x20x7cm, ca. 4 - 5 Baht) available in every village, you will get the cheapest construction (so I did it in few cases). Any other better insulating blocks - when single laid - will bring you nothing better.

With beams you have not only the vertical columns but necessity of the horizontal construction that if by concrete, the long framing job, rebars, etc. And without the beams you do not waste time with digging the holes for them, just made a simple foundation ring for the walls, connected with concrete floor (yes, the bamboo grid is OK enough). Of course, the floor level a bit risen above the usual terrain.

About the difference of the beam (sau) skelet construction and a double wall, I wrote it here somewhere in detail, the difference in time and in money too. It is only persuade the Thai builders to do it by that way., i.e you have to be with them. Such a house with double wall - raw construction prepared for roof construction - you can finish within 1 week (4 workers). Do it with saus, you will need 6 - 8 weeks.
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Klondyke » Mon May 25, 2015 8:33 pm

I did not mentioned, of course some steel rebars laid in horizontally under few layers are to be implemented. As well as in the corners, and at the openings for doors some vertical bars in-between the walls, creating such a concrete column.
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Cheeryble » Mon May 25, 2015 8:34 pm

Roger Ramjet wrote:
Cheeryble wrote:Guessing the actual screeding will be thicker than a wall screed and if direct on earth will need some light rebar or have seen it done with bamboo.

Yesterday I was at Thai Watsadu Bang Bua Thong and noticed they now have three different types of "demountables" for sale. I didn't stop and get the details, but I can this weekend if you like.


Thanks for that Roger, was in TW just yesterday.....

I gotta say I don't understand what you're getting at and what are "demountables"??
I wait with bated breath!
Cheeryble
 
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Cheeryble » Mon May 25, 2015 8:42 pm

Klondyke wrote:For such a simple house I would not do beams (sau - as usually in Thailand) but double block (or brick) wall that is selfstanding and what the best - is well insulating. If you do it by the cement blocks (40x20x7cm, ca. 4 - 5 Baht) available in every village, you will get the cheapest construction (so I did it in few cases). Any other better insulating blocks - when single laid - will bring you nothing better.

With beams you have not only the vertical columns but necessity of the horizontal construction that if by concrete, the long framing job, rebars, etc. And without the beams you do not waste time with digging the holes for them, just made a simple foundation ring for the walls, connected with concrete floor (yes, the bamboo grid is OK enough). Of course, the floor level a bit risen above the usual terrain.

About the difference of the beam (sau) skelet construction and a double wall, I wrote it here somewhere in detail, the difference in time and in money too. It is only persuade the Thai builders to do it by that way., i.e you have to be with them. Such a house with double wall - raw construction prepared for roof construction - you can finish within 1 week (4 workers). Do it with saus, you will need 6 - 8 weeks.


Interested in what you say Klondyke....

In fact I was aware that if you use (I think it was) a 150mm (6 inch) lightweight block with a bit of added rebar as you speak of it is fine to support a metal roof.
(I think the rebar goes from bottom to top and is to hold down the roof)

Are you speaking of making a cavity wall with two thin layers of regular heavy blocks and a gap between I think?
And you say thes insulate just as well as the single thermalite?

I kinda like the thermolite blocks they lay very neatly, are insulating of course, and good for drilling and cutting.

So what would be the specs for the concrete wall foundations?
A concrete strip foundation with rebar presumably?
Bit like the regular wall beams but without the feet and pillars? That's a real saving, and as you say would really speed up the job.
D'you know of this being Ok'd by an engineer as acceptable?

If so I would be interested indeed.
Cheeryble
 
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Roger Ramjet » Mon May 25, 2015 11:11 pm

Cheeryble wrote:I gotta say I don't understand what you're getting at and what are "demountables"??

They appeared to be one bedroom "cottages" that they transported or built on site. They have a frontage of glass sliding doors, the rest is a variety of materials, but I'll have closer look if you like.
Yhey appear to be styled on Sherawood homes.
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Cheeryble » Tue May 26, 2015 12:48 am

Roger Ramjet wrote:
Cheeryble wrote:I gotta say I don't understand what you're getting at and what are "demountables"??

They appeared to be one bedroom "cottages" that they transported or built on site. They have a frontage of glass sliding doors, the rest is a variety of materials, but I'll have closer look if you like.
Yhey appear to be styled on Sherawood homes.


Grateful for the input believe me Roger, but don't put yourself out....
What I am planning is not big but I hope it will end up looking and feeling solid like a real little house and by the time some cute tiles are embedded in it and a floor is painted in translucent finsih and I knock out a couple of black and white paintings and some chunky plants are growing and there's water with water sounds it'll look mighty stylish.

Again thanks for the offer.
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Klondyke » Tue May 26, 2015 8:56 am

Cheeryble wrote:Interested in what you say Klondyke....
Are you speaking of making a cavity wall with two thin layers of regular heavy blocks and a gap between I think?
And you say thes insulate just as well as the single thermalite?

I kinda like the thermolite blocks they lay very neatly, are insulating of course, and good for drilling and cutting.


It is very simple: These are concrete blocks (not very light) made surely in a village near to you by a cement and sand on a primitive (but easy) press machine. The blocks are partly hollowed.

Just laid with a gap in-between some 3 - 5 cm, this gap cab ne later filled by a sawdust (khee luei) or ash dust (khee tau) or just leave it free. I laid horizontally a steel wire 3mm (ng hun) underneath 2nd - 3rd layer buried into the connecting cement mortar. And in the corners - or wherever you would have Saus - you create a concrete column with vertical (some stronger bars 5 - 8 mm), similar that are inside the Saus you would buy.

I do not have detail pictures of the wall, something can be seen here when I made a drying kiln, you see there also the blocks:

Image

And here you can see the wall thickness better where I made an extention to a house in ruins we bought 10 years ago.
Image
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Re: Costing for cabins

Postby Klondyke » Tue May 26, 2015 9:06 am

The original walls in house made by single bricks or blocks were every evening always very hot inside when exposed to afternoon sunshine, keeping the room warm up to late night. Comparison with the double wall where on a hand touch you can feel the difference 5 - 7 deg.

Therefore on the single wall I had provided an outside cladding by a 1" polystyrene white foam covered by WPC planks (artificial wood). Now, there is no temperature difference inside the two wall constructions to be found.

Image
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