New village build near Udon

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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby ajarnudon » Sat Mar 25, 2017 11:12 pm

"It appears you are waterproofing the first lean mix base; an alternative method to a sheet membrane.
then you go on to comment about the water table.
so; are you ordering waterproof connie now buy the wagon load; otherwise I dont see the point of adding Lanko to the lean mix.
A lean mix is normally used to prevent water loss and levelling for the main mix but does not waterproof anything alone."

Yes, eyecatcher you are right in every case. My builder is offsite until Monday, and I wasn't sure how far these guys would go before he and I were both back on site on Monday. So I rushed out and got the Lanko, and got my wife to message him that no concrete be poured before we were both sure of requirements. Still waiting for for timber and shoring in any case.
Cheers, John
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby Sometimewoodworker » Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:12 am

ajarnudon wrote:As I said earlier, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. The concrete will come from the same source as my wife's sister's house, local builders, and no concrete problems whatsoever. I will visit the batch plant on Monday with the builder, and will make sure that that the mix is right. I will also do a slump test before any of it is poured. No added water on site, and I will be there watching.
BTW, from one elevation, how have you surmised the shape of the footings?


It looks as if you are on top of the potential problems.

Once cured there is no visual difference between 1500 psi and 5500psi concrete, low strength concrete can be completely OK, it all depends on the design. Usual Thai designed domestic buildings allow for the low strength mix that is standard. The only problem you might see is if the design called for a higher strength mix than was used. Problems like these often become apparent months or years after the build.

I will be interested to see if Red Eagle will do the test, your plant may be able to mix the concrete to a specific slump, mine can not/will not.

As to the wall design I was assuming based on your original design and the shape and width of the holes and trenches, the trenches don't seem wide enough to hold the base of an L shaped footing.
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby ajarnudon » Wed Mar 29, 2017 7:38 pm

Well, not a lot happenned last week, but it's all systems go this week. Six workers on site the last couple of days with the builder spending a couple of hours there every day. And the first concrete pour has been brought forward from Friday until tomorow (Thursday).
20170329_162348.jpg

Two of the girls tying up the rebar for the columns. You can see the the size difference between the holes in the foreground - the larger one on the right is 1m x 1m, the smaller one on the left 0.8 x 0.8, and both 1m deep. They will take columns of 40 x 40 cms and 20 x 20 cms respectively, and are spaced alternately at either 2.3 or 2.7m centres.
20170329_162421.jpg


The guys are wiring up the columns to the reo cages in the bottom of the holes. The higher columns (4.6m from the footing) will be part of the outer wall of the garage.
However, if today proved anything, it was that if anything important is happening, which is just about every day, I have to be on site. Firstly, I was interested to see what would happen when they put the reo cages in the bottom of the holes. I hadn't seen anyone making up luk bun, the small mortar chairs they pour ahead of time to support the steel. As I suspected, they just dropped the cages straight onto the bottom of the hole. You can't do that! While they poured a shallow bed of concrete in the bottom of the holes a couple of days ago, the pour tomorrow will not be contiguous and certainly water will find its way betwen the two. More important than usual as the footings will be below the water table for at least half the year. Luckily I had foreseen what might happen, and stopped off to buy a diamond concrete cutting wheel on the way to the site. I went to the local BS shop and bought 20 small blocks and cut them up into chairs for them to use.
Secondly, before I left I inspected the first five holes in which the columns had been wired to the cages. The first one, closest to the soi, has an oversize hole and it is fine. The rest however were not. As mentioned above, the holes are either 1m square or 80cm square, for the 40x40 or 20x20 columns. And that's just the size they made the cages (no concrete cover around the outside of the steel again). Sorry boys, you'll have to pull those out and make the holes wider. I will end up with larger footings (a bonus), but they might learn something in the process - if you don't do it right, you'll have to do it again, and if you're not sure, ask! I might take my mistake fixer on site tomorow to have it on display - a 7lb sledge hammer.
Big day coming up tomorow.
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby Roger Ramjet » Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:38 pm

ajarnudon wrote: I might take my mistake fixer on site tomorow to have it on display - a 7lb sledge hammer.
Big day coming up tomorow.

If you wish to bind concrete to concrete the best way is Lanko 751 I used about 5 drums of it even in the render mix or any place where concrete was being poured onto concrete. Here's a photo of the container download/file.php?id=12134&mode=view and if you go a few pages forward and backwards you'll see how I made the steel chairs that were rust proofed before sitting the rebar on them or wired into the rebar as with the garage build.
I refused to let them use the concrete donuts on anything other than the columns. They break too easily.
The rebar chairs are simple to make if you have a welder, if not then use the simple ones I made for the garage and wire them to the trench mesh or rebar.
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby Roger Ramjet » Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:38 pm

ajarnudon wrote: I might take my mistake fixer on site tomorow to have it on display - a 7lb sledge hammer.
Big day coming up tomorow.

If you wish to bind concrete to concrete the best way is Lanko 751 I used about 5 drums of it even in the render mix or any place where concrete was being poured onto concrete. Here's a photo of the container download/file.php?id=12134&mode=view and if you go a few pages forward and backwards you'll see how I made the steel chairs that were rust proofed before sitting the rebar on them or wired into the rebar as with the garage build.
I refused to let them use the concrete donuts on anything other than the columns. They break too easily.
The rebar chairs are simple to make if you have a welder, if not then use the simple ones I made for the garage and wire them to the trench mesh or rebar.
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby ajarnudon » Thu Mar 30, 2017 6:02 pm

This is probably a better graphical representation of what we are doing at the moment.
You'll need to click on the image to see the detail.
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South Wall.jpg
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby Roger Ramjet » Thu Mar 30, 2017 8:10 pm

ajarnudon wrote:This is probably a better graphical representation of what we are doing at the moment.

Don't forget to put drains into the retaining walls. During the last floods a lot of walls just "fell over" because they didn't have drainage holes in them for the water to go through.
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby ajarnudon » Thu Mar 30, 2017 11:13 pm

Spoke to the builder about that today RR. Using 390 x 190 x 140 blocks on the bottom three courses which will be core filled and reinforced both horizontally and verticaly. The bottom course of blocks will have no mortar between every second block, leaving weep holes. There wil also be a slotted 8 cm pipe behind that course set in 30 x 30 cms of aggregate taking water through the end wall into the paddy field. The pipe will be wrapped with porous membrane extending up the inside of the wall past the weep holes and aggregate to minimise clogging by silt.
Hydrostatic pressure is the no. 1 cause of retaining wall failure.
Thr Rain Gods have forced a postponement and all of the holes have become swimming pools again. The builder bought a submersible pump and had a couple of guys pumping water out when I left. Think it wil be at least two or three days now before we can pour any concrete. Forecast is for a possible storm tomorow (Friday), but for three dry days after that.
By the way Pipoz, I ordered 1,000 of these (what is known locally as) superblocks @ 19 baht each today. Funnily enough, when I first spoke to the builder about using these blocks, he told me 35 baht each - the figure you paid. I had priced them at 19 baht back in November direct from the manufacturer. Now the builder tells me he knows the supplier well; makes you wonder.
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby ajarnudon » Thu Apr 06, 2017 7:31 pm

John's patented slump test aparatus
Slump test.jpg


The builder and I had a meeting with the concrete supplier last week. It turns out that the new batch plant is owned by the family that has the local BS shop, and whose macro I have hired before. The Siam City Cement logos around the plant are only meant to convey that they use SCC cement in their concrete. A good meeting, and I explained that as the wall footings will be below the water table for at least six months of the year, all concrete under natural ground level will have to be high steng, low slump with added Lanko 322. He told me that was fine by him, but it would be very hard work for the labourers. I brought the builder into the conversation, and said that the answer was not more water, but more workers onsite for the pour. I brought out my cutoff traffic cone and asked the concrete supplier if he knew what it was. Straight up he said,' Slump, slump.' So we all understood what was needed and what would be acceptable.
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby Roger Ramjet » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:24 pm

John,
I don't know how much concrete you are pouring, but it appears to be a substantial quantity so the builder should have a "wriggler" that should be "dipped" into the concrete after about 2 foot is poured and repeated until it reaches the top. I found the best way to gauge it is by a 1 to 5 count going down and coming up. Do not over-do it, it's a simple count, not slow count. And Lanko 322 will assist in the pour. Do not let them bullshit about more water in the mix it screws up the steng the more they add.
Both myself and the builder climbed the back of the concrete truck (Fast Crete) and the drivers knew it would be rejected if it was soup. I also did a bit of travelling to the concrete plant when the mix was being done and made sure it was the correct steng (mix) that went into the hopper by looking at their computer. Then followed the truck back to the build so the driver couldn't add more water to please the builder.
I also used a crane with a 1 metre bucket to get to the hard parts and for the beams on both floors as well as the slabs.
Fast Crete had their rep on site a lot and their service was excellent and spot on time.
If you're going to check the load make sure you have a good spotlight and look for water floating on the surface of the concrete mix.
Make sure you don't lose the water through the sand at the sides of the holes. I had my builder put in cheap cinder blocks to stop that, which probably cost all of 300 baht but gave me peace of mind knowing the crucial areas were strong enough to withstand even a large earthquake.
When I did the house I tied in every bit of rebar to and including the framework for the roof, so it created a Faraday Cage just in case the house was struck by lightening. But that will be for later.
Good luck, it looks and sounds okay, except for the part where the factory and builder agreed on more water. You'll have to watch them all the way.
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby ajarnudon » Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:43 am

Poured six cubes yesterday into the reinforced footings for 17 of the wall columns. Da and I took the Lanko 322 to the batch plant and measured it into the Steng 240 mix. The first three holes were not directly accessible to the concrete truck, so it was into the tub then buckets. It was hard work because of the stiff mix, but with nine wotkers on site, they handled it well. The other 14 holes were easy, and were poured direct from the truck, using a sheet of old roofing iron as a chute extension. The foreman vibrated each hole poured.
tn_20170406_133243.jpg
The ultra modern control room at the batch plant

Boss at batch plant.jpg
My boss

Adding Lanko 322.jpg
Adding the Lanko 322

That's Tun, the plant owner, at the back. He couldn't have been more accommodating.
Pricelist.jpg
Price list for different strengths

Having watched the batch being mixed and being satisfied that it was a good stiff mix, my slump cone remains a virgin.
tn_20170406_091743.jpg

Pouring the first hole. It was such a relief to get those holes poured and feel that something concrete had been achieved (pardon the pun), rather than just having holes filling up with water. Job finished by midday, and the workers appreciated the carton of beer I put on for them.
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby eyecatcher » Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:56 am

"Wriggler"?
Is that the p.c way of not calling it by its proper name.....a poker vibrator :lol:
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby pipoz » Sun Apr 09, 2017 10:32 am

ajarnudon wrote:Poured six cubes yesterday into the reinforced footings for 17 of the wall columns. Da and I took the Lanko 322 to the batch plant and measured it into the Steng 240 mix. The first three holes were not directly accessible to the concrete truck, so it was into the tub then buckets. It was hard work because of the stiff mix, but with nine wotkers on site, they handled it well. The other 14 holes were easy, and were poured direct from the truck, using a sheet of old roofing iron as a chute extension. The foreman vibrated each hole poured.

Pouring the first hole. It was such a relief to get those holes poured and feel that something concrete had been achieved (pardon the pun), rather than just having holes filling up with water. Job finished by midday, and the workers appreciated the carton of beer I put on for them.



We done. Those little excavators are a winner

Prices for Readymix are cheap in Thailand, aren't they

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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby ajarnudon » Tue Apr 11, 2017 5:51 am

Mighty Ford Ranger.jpg
The mighty Ford Ranger fully laden with rented shuttering for the wall footing
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Re: New village build near Udon

Postby ajarnudon » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:14 pm

I have sacked the local crew working on site; they will not be allowed back. They worked liked Trojans while the builder was on site then stopped for smoke breaks and a chat as soon as he left. I had told them at least 10 times that all reo under the ground must have a min 5 cms of concrete cover - still they place it on the ground or touching the trench sides. I am sick of having to call them back to correct their sloppy work. When the builder was there I explained what I needed done; he passed it on to the foreman who acknowledged it - who then never did it. I called a meeting with the builder yesterday morning, and expressed my many concerns about sloppy work, subervisiness, lies and damned lies. And one of them stole my hammer! For different reasons, the builder agreed - @ 400 baht/head/day they did very little, and he knows they are very lazy and deceitful. So today we have hung the cue in the rack, and he had one of his foremen from Udon come up and inspect the site with him. His crew will take over after Songkran. There was no chance that I would have allowed the first crew to do anything on site when I was not there. I am hopeful that the Udon crew will prove more reliable and follow instructions - if this is the case, then the builder and I can sit down and agree on limited progress in my absence with pictures before I consent to progress. Fortunately we have family in the village whom I can trust to sit on site and call us if anything becomes a problem (like adding water to the batched concrete.
Took the shuttering off the first section of the footing pour today (after 2 two days) and it looks good. A couple of superficial cracks in the top that aren't a concern (from 38 degree pouring heat) but the builder and I are both sure that this isn't a problem, and we are watering it three times a day. Particularly as the the first three courses of 14 cm wide blocks will be core filled with concrete and reinforced both vertically @ 60 cm ccs, and horizontally in the third course.
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