Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby runker » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:01 pm

Any plans for soffit vents?
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby gliffaes » Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:04 pm

runker wrote:Any plans for soffit vents?


No plans as the entire last row of tiles is vented so no need. There is always a howling wind up here too.

Today the ceiling man started, we got off to a good start as his method of attaching the ceiling metal to the walls an mine somewhat differed, his method use as many masonry nails as you can and if you hit them hard enoguh you can surely break lumps neatly out of the walls, my method a drill ( a novelty i know) two screws and two rawlplugs.
Where the metal meets the wall. For the "L" shaped piece that sits on the wall ie all the perimeter, masonry nails are ok but for the main cross members no way.
He then called my wife and told her to do it my way will be 2000 baht more, his price is 4000 the "Thai way" and 6000 the stupid idiotic Farang way.
Anyway I told him 5500 and that was that. Thats for 50m2 of ceiling, he started at 90 baht a m2 then i pointed to the insulation to lay and up it went then we had the Thai V Farang way
They really are bone idle in all their work practices here.
Later after he'd gone leaving his nub ends on the floor and the place like a bombsite, I found out what the large bang and shout was that I heard earlier in the day.
Yes he had managed to drop ( no doubt to his carelessness) some large object onto my nice plastic windows resulting in one broken moulding which I will point out to him in the morning and I know he will say it wasnt him yet I know as I claen the bloomin things almost daily that it wasnt like that yesterday.
NoW have to see if I can get a new moulding via Global house from the manufacturer Wellington WINDOWS.
You coudlnt make it up, we were so careful with the windows form the off , lazy twa*s no other words for them really.
So the Thai way is to cut the cross members short of the actual length needed across the room then nail them to the wall leaving a large section near the wall floating in mid air, thats when the nails actually went in ok, i'll ignore the half dozen that were half in or bent over at an angle.
Strangely they seem to have used my hammer drill, hammer and anything else they could pick up.
Tomorrow my tools go back in the car they can break their own as it seems the only way many of them can use a power tool here is by BRUTE force until you hear the poor motor struggling to cope as they try and ram it thru or into anything they can, gently does it doesnt seem to exist here for many.
As you can see it was a "good day"
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby gliffaes » Wed Jun 13, 2012 6:26 am

When speaking with the ceiling man I showed him the tape I had boguht for where each sheet of plasterboard joins another, its a self adhesive mesh tape ( use it in the UK) he looked at it and said"no" ( an implication it doesnt need it was the understanding I got) Now I dont know what he plans to do but without this he wont be doing any jointing whilst Im around.
What did your builders use??
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby geordie » Wed Jun 13, 2012 7:46 am

Added character to the window already :roll: The jointing tape is a must have as far as i am concerned otherwise cracking is a certainty but being thai he probably see,s it as an expense :mrgreen: I cannot beleive you swallowed it and paid the ceiling fixer extra for doing it properly ?? had it been me there would be no window damage i would have chased him when he made his demands i would sruitinise th wall and charge him for any cracks he made :wink: as payback
my comments may be wrong but never deliberately
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby gliffaes » Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:50 pm

geordie wrote:Added character to the window already :roll: The jointing tape is a must have as far as i am concerned otherwise cracking is a certainty but being thai he probably see,s it as an expense :mrgreen: I cannot beleive you swallowed it and paid the ceiling fixer extra for doing it properly ?? had it been me there would be no window damage i would have chased him when he made his demands i would sruitinise th wall and charge him for any cracks he made :wink: as payback


Its a time issue Geordie + i dont know how they attach the metal to the walls here ( I did ask) and i couldnt see it in any of the photos on the website of other builds and ones I could see didnt looked screwed on at all. Climbed thru service hatch at my condo i Hua Hin and saw the metal edging attached by masonry nail but could not see how the main metal was attached as aircon unit blocked view so assumed masonry nail was the norm although unwanted by me. This is one problem I have had is " what is the normal way here" to do things. Im not saying I want the normal way but when Somchai prices it up I need to know how it will be done and of course Wife in BKK again hard to get over whats being said/explained
Dont know if I mentioned the builder told us he would send the ceiling crew SUNDAY but no one came, Wife called him phone turned off, she called him again Monday he says coming soon, later he changes it to he hasnt anyone to do it. In other words all was Bull from the day he said he would send someone, We found the current guy thru the Makro man, and of course guess who WONT be doing the main house now??? along with the original builder, although most of his workers can be used privately.
Proving he broke the window is nigh on impossible, Wife calls him " you broke our window" his answer " not me" and I wasnt in the room to see it, although I usually am, I was painting the outside barge board at the time, what do you do??
I have an inkling one of our other men saw him do this and wife is checking it out BUT will this other worker say so??? Doubt it. Thai love Thai.
Oh an with the tape if i dont see any tape going on he will be out the door pronto as i know it WILL crack if it doesnt go on.
The reason to get the ceiling done fast is to get the electric on, to get some lights on especially the security lights ( automatic) to make it appear the house is occupied whilst Im away for 3 months.
What isnt finsihed is kitchen and bathrooms and tiling an painting...................oh yeah the builder said this wasnt done as " I didnt have a plan" so we'll just forget about his " my ceiling men will be there Sunday" bull story eh hahahaha.
Ive got more planning in my little finger than him.
All will be done when Im back now all work stops Tuesday next week.
Oh yeah builder said 1-2 month maximum, i think we are at +3 already, he's in deep doo doo with money is selling his house for 6 million and when the wife called him to say wheres the ceiling crew on Sunday ( answered Monday) his first comment to her on answering her calls was " have you sold my house yet" ( Wife sells houses and condos) and NOT sorry i dont have a crew, even she was pis**ed with him.
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby gliffaes » Wed Jun 13, 2012 9:37 pm

The only good thing to come out of this is that I now know when ever having any work done to show and tell them BEFORE they start the way I want it done. To physically get out a piece of metal a screw and a rawlplug, ask them if they have a drill and a masonry bit etc.
This way there can be no arguing point no " this is the normal way we do it here"
I find all this minute detail extremely tedious and tiring but for the main build there will be no exception.
You have to remember this is the "trial run" so far it hasnt been too bad and Ive learnt how to sort out some of the ridiculous ways things " get or dont get done" here.
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby pattayapope » Thu Jun 14, 2012 7:43 am

Gliffaes keep up the crusade, too many things these days are made with special adhesives and staple guns. Place looking good, how did you make out on the budget?
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby gliffaes » Sun Jun 17, 2012 7:49 pm

pattayapope wrote:Gliffaes keep up the crusade, too many things these days are made with special adhesives and staple guns. Place looking good, how did you make out on the budget?

Wife is counting i havent a clue and currently having a spot of bother.

me " is that scaffolding safe"
Builder "yes fine no problem"
me " arghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh"

Result.............feels like broken ribs, x rays when I can move again, 3 days now, difficulty breathing,

builder "yes safe for Thai"
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby sirineou » Sun Jun 17, 2012 8:00 pm

Man asks other man with dog:"excuse me sir, does your dog bite?"
Answer: No
Man,tries to pet the dog and the dog bites him.
He angrily asks, " I Thought you said your dog, does not bite!!"
reply: That's not my dog :lol:

Sorry I don't mean to make light of your situation, but I could not help but laugh, when I read your post.
Hope you feel better soon.
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby MGV12 » Mon Jun 18, 2012 5:58 am

gliffaes wrote:
Result.............feels like broken ribs, x rays when I can move again, 3 days now, difficulty breathing,

builder "yes safe for Thai"


Sorry it's after the event ...

Warning! Never climb anything made of bamboo in Thailand .... unless maybe you happen to have a prehensile tail!

Friend climbed a bamboo ladder to clear his rain gutters ... can easily afford to hire someone for such tasks ... rung broke, gravity caused others to break, landed badly, resulting in foot literally waving in the breeze. Nine months to recover ... he's in his late sixties and the doctor reckons arthritis will set in. Ho hum.

Hope you heal quickly gliffaes and there are no lingering problems ... I know from multiple experiences that rib damage is not nice ... for sure.

“Some days I am an optimistic pessimist ... other days I am a pessimistic optimist”
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby gliffaes » Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:27 am

sirineou wrote:Man asks other man with dog:"excuse me sir, does your dog bite?"
Answer: No
Man,tries to pet the dog and the dog bites him.
He angrily asks, " I Thought you said your dog, does not bite!!"
reply: That's not my dog :lol:

Sorry I don't mean to make light of your situation, but I could not help but laugh, when I read your post.
Hope you feel better soon.


Ha haaha that could be a Thai dog too!
Reminds me of the Irishman who when asked by his neighbour how many rolls of wallpaper did he use when he papered his dining room told the neighbour "20", neighbour goes out buys 20 rolls, papers his dining room and sees the neighbour and says " hey I had 6 rolls spare when id finished" neighbour says " yes so did I"
House update, sorry no pics Ill try to get som e today, all work stops tomorrow until October.
We dug the electric and water trenches, water 16 inches deep electric 18 inches deep ( ground like concrete and full of stones)
HDPE piping in and connected one end will test today, electric trunking 32mm in and then inserted main supply cable twin 10mm nyy weighs a ton.
Method to get 36 mteres trhu trunking.
Insert hosepipe into trunking run some water thru ( we are on a downhill slope) attach nylon line to a thin plastic bag which acts as a piston.
Put hose back into trunking and force thru plastic bag with line attached.
Then pull thru main pulling line.
Tape Main supply cable to main pulling line, attach pick up to other end of pulling line, drive off pulling cable thru. As being pulled thru spray with silicone lubricant.
Half of the Windsor guttering is up, other half today, poor design for joining each section together means use of angle grinder to take off the top thickest section so it easily slides into the straight connectors.
Looks good, slope quarter inch per 10 foot or on my house fall of about just over 1 an a 1/4 inches form 1 side round the front to the end. Have only used 2 outlets which run into 4 inch waste pipe UNDER my path and away form the house.
If I can lift up the camera will get photos later but having trouble raising up arms etc.
Electircs almost finsihed will be done today, ceiling man coming back but he only has 2 days to do it so am not sure he will complete.
I have 4 security lights round the house with sensors which will be left on.
Electric was cut off on the day I was in BKK, the tails were removed by the electric co,, Electrician soon sorted that out and now we have electric again. Will pay bill today and pay in advance for 3 months.
The fall was due to me concentrating too much on the guttering, I was on a scaffold tower made of steel, albeit propped up on bricks etc due to stony land, builder threw some planks of wood across for a platform, I asked for another one and I didnt watch what he did next as (I was literally holding the guttering in my hands) which was throw up a section of shera board and although 1 inch thick it really isnt strong, anyway I didnt see him do this and stepped back onto it AND OF COURSE it just snapped in half.
I didnt hit the ground but fell ribs first onto the metal cross members.

Anyway today as u can see I am feeling a lot better so hopefully things are on the mend, I am of course a youngster here also so heal a bit faster.
Funnily enough I drove to Bangkok the same day i did it, got stopped by the Police, struggled to get out of the car showed them my back and they became very sympathetic. the one even joked "did my Wife do this" ( maybe it happens to them often when they are blind drunk)
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby sirineou » Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:08 pm

I am glad you are feeling better.
If you have not back filled the trenches for the electric or water yet, it is a good idea to ,
After back filling half way, take a role of yellow or orange caution tape (if you can find some), and lay a langth of it in the back fill and then continue back filling.
as a caution to anyone digging in the area in the future.
I doubt that it would help very much , any Thai digging would probably ignore the caution tape, thinking it is one of the thousands of shopping bags that liter Thailand :(
but it could not hurt.
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby gliffaes » Mon Jun 18, 2012 9:49 pm

sirineou wrote:I am glad you are feeling better.
If you have not back filled the trenches for the electric or water yet, it is a good idea to ,
After back filling half way, take a role of yellow or orange caution tape (if you can find some), and lay a langth of it in the back fill and then continue back filling.
as a caution to anyone digging in the area in the future.
I doubt that it would help very much , any Thai digging would probably ignore the caution tape, thinking it is one of the thousands of shopping bags that liter Thailand :(
but it could not hurt.


Yes I think it would be totally ignored, in fact Im sure if it said caution unexploded bomb down here they would still carry on because "AND TRUST ME ON THIS" they really CAN be that stupid.
Today electrician wired up all the house and then I noticed the security lights switches for the outside ( 4 total) also managed to turn on and off the wall sockets...................incredibly he seemed to think this is what I wanted??????? even though he had been told 2 circuits for power, one does all the kitchen SOCKETS one does the living and bedroom SOCKETS, ok so thats two circuits then ONE for all lights throughout, one for shower one for aircon.
BUT NO he thinks I want all the KITCHEN LIGHTS AND power SOCKETS ON ONE BREAKER?????????????? The fact one is running 1.5mm cable and the other 2.5mm cable obviously means nowt to him all on a 20A??
So then he has to climb back into the NOW almost fully boarded roof ( ceiling man came another tale of incompetence) to try and sort this out.
So using the THAI international colour coding system we now have a light circuit with a YELLOW CABLE? a GREEN CABLE ( earth) and an almost ALL BLACK CABLE mostly live + SOME red cable, oH AND WE MUST PAY FOR THE YELLOW CABLE.
So at 5 pm we have one working security light and one security light switch which turns on an off the bedroom sockets.................. good eh.

Now lets move onto the ceiling man, no doubt been doing it for years.
I told him I want a grid of 60cm in all rooms with the metal work, REASON, insulation is in 60cm wide rolls makes it easy to lay across the metal work.
First room lounge he does fine , maybe he thinks hey this is good I just roll out the insulation and it fits the room perfectly ( its a 4 metre wide room. rolls are 4m long) but of course I planned all this and of course he wouldnt even think about it at all......... if he actually thinks anyway??
Then we move into the bedroom its 4m x 3M so OBVIOUSLY you would of course lay the insulation the same way , 4 m rolls goes across the 4m wall right???
Well NO apparently its MUCH easier to lay 4 m across the 3 metre wall and just stuff 1 metre UP ( 50 cm each end) the wall behind the ceiling and then come in and say " there isnt enough insulation"
Also for some reason known only to him, he lays the metal the wrong way round ie the 4 metre long pieces should be UNDER the shorter 3m pieces, done the complete opposite way to the main living room.
So next they have to cut off the 1 metre pieces of each section and tape them all together to get another length but instead of just pulling the insulation along to get 1 full metre..................yep they cut 50 cm of each end!!!!!!!!!!
I arrived at 10am today, when I got there ( you see not on site for just 2 hours getting other materials) he had the main living room ceiling up BUT half of the metal sections i know he hadnt screwed to the walls IN FACT he hadnt even nailed them either, so now the living room ceiling has half the metal work in one direction screwed up and the other with no wall fastening at all except for a single screw into the very thin "L" shaped section running around the rooms perimeter thru the plasterboard and up into the L piece, of course its actually held up by the ceiling wires but thats not the point its just sh** practice.
No you may ask"why" didnt he screw up the other pieces as we have agreed to pay an extra 1500 baht for screws not nails, well its simple......... i wasnt there, he thought if he got it up quick I wouldnt be able to see it ( he doesnt know I can climb) but sadly for him I was up the electrician ladder in the next room to see all the non attached pieces of metalwork. The bill will be reduced tomorrow.
His girlfriend did an excellent job of sawing the plasterboard with a blunt rusty snap off knife, it was just painful to watch her amateur effort.
This team will NOT be used on the mainhouse.
Photos tomorrow night as its the last day.
OH YEAH I forgot the guttering went up perfectly..........................because I DID IT with my one man who is half decent.
Some comments on WINDSOR guttering, the jointing brackets are way too difficult to join the lengths unless you bevel the top edge of the guttering, otherwise you cannot push them in easily. Siliconing each joint is not so clever, in the UK we have proper rubber seals. The downpipe attachment pieces are also siliconed together, its a poor way to do it. I am sure they will slowly work their way out so I put a small screw into each piece to stop this. The downpipe is also terribly thin whilst the connecting angled pieces are MUCH thicker.
Never a dull moment. i will try to get the total on cost soon
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby gliffaes » Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:09 pm

I think Ill round up with a few tips for anyone thinking of building ( if you dont have to, dont)
1 NEVER LEAVE THE SITE best time to get anything is 12-1pm they will definitely stop to eat.
2. show them how you want it then watch them do it then check every piece if multiples for tightness/correctness, often they would put in a screw and it wasnt holding at all or what they fastened was cockeyed.
3 if you dont want a tool used keep it in the car, they will use and mangle anything they can lay there sticky paws on
4 keep girlfriends and kids off site.
5 expect them to do it the worst/cheapest/nastiest/fastest/shoddiest possible way at ALL times and then some.
They will render a wall then a few days later happily smash lumps out of it, in general they are CLUMSY and DIRTY/ UNTIDY, they will leave crap everywhere.
6 try not to have more than 3 workers doing anything as it gets almost impossible to watch what they are doing in time to stop them.
7 the stupidity will drain the life out of you, you spend most of the day trying to make it as simple as possible for them only to find they have found yet another way of doing it "better"

Conclusion DO AS MUCH AS U CAN YOURSELF unless you are VERY lucky, i think MOST of them work this way.

The main house i will do with just 2 other men as all the others have been basically cretins almost unable to know which end of a hammer does the hitting, many seem to have a vacant look.
Im sure (somewhere in Thailand) there are "some" workers who "might" take a pride in their work, most drop tools at 5pm, literally where they stand, and walk off leaving the blunt rusty tool on the floor.
The word "BODGE" could only have been invented in Thailand.
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Re: Dream House Build for 1/5th the Price

Postby gliffaes » Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:38 pm

sirineou wrote:I am glad you are feeling better.
If you have not back filled the trenches for the electric or water yet, it is a good idea to ,
After back filling half way, take a role of yellow or orange caution tape (if you can find some), and lay a langth of it in the back fill and then continue back filling.
as a caution to anyone digging in the area in the future.
I doubt that it would help very much , any Thai digging would probably ignore the caution tape, thinking it is one of the thousands of shopping bags that liter Thailand :(
but it could not hurt.

What I did do with the water was first bury it in sand about 6 inches so if you dig down and find sand you are getting close.
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