Another Swimming Pool Build

Any thing to do with swimming pools, fish ponds, or other man made structures which hold water (but not wells for drinking water).

Moderators: Sometimewoodworker, MGV12, BKKBILL, pattayapope

Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby MGV12 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 11:53 am

MGV12 wrote:Would have thought an enterprising member would have been importing them by now!



Steve&mem wrote:Import, you’re joking, us cheap Charlie’s won’t pay the price.


We do need to get a tongue-in-cheek emoticon on this site!

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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby Steve&mem » Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:10 pm

Diggers turned up today to dig out the surge tank by hand, according to my thermometer its
35 degrees out there.
IMAG0570.jpg


As you can see in the background we have a small above ground pool already, this is about 21,000 litres.
We brought this over from the UK in our luggage but it took several trips to do it.
We used to put it up when we came for holidays and then the day before we left we just pulled the plug and it was put it away again, it only took about 3 or 4 hours to empty clean it and pack it.
The pools is great but the filter cartridges are crap, also to buy them here at 1000 baht each is way over the top, I used to buy a box of 6 for less than that in the UK.
Now that I don’t travel very much it was switched over to a sand filter, this has certainly paid for itself already, but now it’s time to have a proper grown up pool.

The attachment IMAG0570.jpg is no longer available
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IMAG0569.jpg
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby Roger Ramjet » Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:22 pm

steve&mem,
Are these what you're looking for?
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Chairs.jpg
Chairs
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby Steve&mem » Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:29 pm

That’s what I had in mind to lift up the second layer of the rebar in the floor as it looks like I will have a 6'' gap between the two.
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby Roger Ramjet » Sun Dec 02, 2012 1:09 pm

steve&mem,
I used them throughout my build. They are available in Thailand: All you need is 9mm straight rebar rod cut to size, then bent and tack welded in the middle.
There is a complete thread on rebar chairs and when I discovered the fact you couldn't buy them, I told the builder I wanted one of his workers to make-up 500 of them whilst they were bending rebar, waiting for concrete to cure and staying out of the rain. The chairs were then dipped in red rustproof paint after they were welded.
They were used on all slabs, including the double reinforced rebar swimming pool.
If you start with a concrete base of 2 inches or use prestressed concrete planks and then apply a bonding agent, there is absolutely no need to use plastic sheeting (available from all garden suppliers or Thai Watsadu stores) under the slab. However, when we did the garage floor we used plastic sheeting over compacted sand and no holes appeared in the plastic sheeting even though the workers walked all over the rebar sitting on the chairs.
MGV12 is totally correct, an enterprising member could be selling them by the thousand by now.
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby Mike Judd » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:14 pm

That looks like a copy of the chairs that are sold all over Oz for years, except the ends are dipped into a plastic solution to stop rust now days. They come in all sizes for your different layers of steel. As mentioned in another post, where plastic (Forticon) sheeting is used on the ground, it's customary to put Ice-cream tub lids under to protect the plastic. The steel suppliers send them on request in bags. I will have to check the prices this week to see if they are worth making up your self ,even given the low wage costs. As for the damage that occurs to maybe the plastic ? That's all in the supervision, even in Oz I have meticulously checked all the steel , height/ spacing and distance from the formwork etc; and then had half a dozen Concreters (invariably Italian) clomp all over the steel in their Gum boots ,throwing planks /shovels /Vibrators around with me jumping up and down shouting at them to take care. Another thing that seems to be lacking in Thailand is decent steel mesh, all I can see is that thin stuff about 200m.m. squares not much thicker than chicken wire. I'am used to being able to get mesh in what ever thickness you want ,with the best stuff having deformed steel welded up in 2.4mt X 6 mt sheets. As mentioned the average Thai can't afford it but you would think the big developers could, building all those High rises.
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby Roger Ramjet » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:24 pm

Different sized mesh is available at all steel yards in Thailand. It is also available through Thai Watsadu, but sometimes must be ordered depending on the size. Most decent building suppliers have it stored in one of their large sheds; all you have to do is ask.
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby sirineou » Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:57 pm

Mike Judd wrote: As mentioned the average Thai can't afford it but you would think the big developers could, building all those High rises.

The large developers must be using them, I cant imagine the lathers laying steel on a
20,000 sq/ft deck with out them. But I am sure they dont buy their material at Home pro.
The trick would be to find out where they buy them and if they can be purchased in small quantities
But for small quantities, it is so much easier to make, by making small concrete cakes with two wires sticking out of them, why bother?
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby sirineou » Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:49 pm

for any one who is interested, this is a list of concrete accessories suppliers in Thailand, they should have rebar chairs
http://www.tuugo.in.th/Products/Concrete-spacers
Ps: Google is becoming a bad search engine, directing you to paid results. I did a search for Concrete Accessories Thailand, and did not get the above result,I was not directed to what was available, but I think to their commercial subscribers, then I did a search for the same search term on Bing and got different and more relevant results.
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby Mike Judd » Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:05 am

It must be different where you are R.R. Up around Khon Kaen of all the yards, Global House is huge with a 100 yards of 3 lane steel supplies. But only those rolls of light stuff that you wouldn't bother with in a garden path, or as mentioned the same in sheets. And you know how much joy you get out of enquiring. Perhaps one of the guys up around Udon could help. With the chairs Sirineou, there does seem to be plenty available on the web, just have to find a local supplier, or make my own like like everyone does.
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby jazzman » Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:08 pm

Bar charis are simple affairs and don't need to be imported or purchased. They are made easily from RB9.
25 cm concrete is over-engineering for the floor. provided it's supported by beams, 20 cm is enough. Concrete should be at least Steng 210 and must be mixed with waterproofing additive. remember to include the 6" or 8" rubber waterstop strip at the base of the walls and buried halfway down in the concrete of the floor. (this is where many even professional builders cut corners).

When it comes to purchasing technical equipment such as pumps, filters, underwater lights, wall jets, ball valves, etc, do be absolutely sure to shop around. I discovered one pool shop in Udon on Saturday selling stuff for nearly double the reasonable prices. Check out the internet for pool equipment suppliers in Thailand who publish their prices. Remember to use the keyword 'thailand' in your Google search, otherwise you will get thousands of results worldwide. Also, do avoid the nasty cheap Chinese copies of filters and accessories on offer in some large building supplies superstores should be avoided, they are pirated copies for leading brands and are guaranteed - to fail after a few months, and guaranteed to have no customer support. They have substandard castings for the motor housings, and low quality carbon steel motor shafts.
Attachments
Waterstop - after.JPG
Shows the bottom half of the rubber strip embedded in the concrete floor. The wall concrete will be poured down over this creating a perfect seal.
Waterstop - after.JPG (13.93 KiB) Viewed 1327 times
Water stop -  before.JPG
Shows the rubber strip installed, tied to the rebar with wire
Water stop - before.JPG (18.21 KiB) Viewed 1327 times
Waterstop (roll).JPG
A roll of rubber waterstop. Available at most decent builkrs' merchants
Waterstop (roll).JPG (21.81 KiB) Viewed 1327 times
Bar chair.JPG
Bar 'chair' bent from RB9. used to keep the rebar off the floor and to separate the two layers of steel.
Bar chair.JPG (15.32 KiB) Viewed 1327 times
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby Steve&mem » Mon Dec 03, 2012 1:45 pm

Thanks for that Jazzman, your posts on EVERYTHING you NEED to know for your first swimming pool, this has been invaluable reading, and without it I don’t think I would have started this project.

You say when purchasing technical equipment to shop around, I couldn’t agree more. While we have been at a standstill I did a bit of window shopping for prices and here is just one example.
Here is the Main drain grate that I purchased at Global.
Main Drain Grate.jpg

Now here in Udon there are a couple of pool shops on the ring road, not far from Global , both the pool shops I went in tried to sell me the square Main drain grates at a cool 1500 baht, not even saying that they had the cheaper round ones, I declined saying I wanted the 20cm round ones. One shop said that they were 800 baht but would give discount down to 500 baht if I bought with the rest of the fittings etc. etc. the other shop was 500 baht.
Global price 135 Baht, same packaging same markings, in fact I think that’s where the pool shop bought them. :shock: is the pool shop owner :lol: all the way to the bank.

All well back to work, the lads doing the floor of the surge tank have found a soft spot, now this is weird it only about 3ft in diameter, the rest of the ground is solid I will have to get them to dig it out so we can look into it :roll: .
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby jazzman » Mon Dec 03, 2012 2:43 pm

It seems we have done exactly the same research in the same shops on the ring road and come to the same conclusions. As far as I could tell, these are probably a Chinese copy of a genuine branded item that sells for around baht 600. - 700. The Chinese one tends to be less resistant to the chemicals in pools and may not be genuine ABS plastic - it tends to discolour with time, go brittle and break up. Again, do a search for maindrains on the Internet. That said, I wouldn't recommend the 8" 'pot covers' anyway. The 9" x 9" square ones are more robust and much easier to install neatly; they cost a little bit more, but again be aware of anything that comes, or appears to come, from the ring road. Even if it is genuine, it's likely to be grossly overpriced. And if you're going to be gluing PVC pipe, be sure to use the HD glue and not the watery stuff that is used for normal domestic plumbing.
Attachments
Square main  drain - formwork.jpg
The long pipe is just there to hold eveything in place when the concrete is poured. It gets taken out afterwards. The floor of the maindrain can be nicely tiled. On the genuine article, the screws for the main drain cover are special corrosion resistant stainless steel.
Square main drain - formwork.jpg (15.9 KiB) Viewed 1308 times
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby pipoz » Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:55 pm

jazzman wrote:Bar charis are simple affairs and don't need to be imported or purchased. They are made easily from RB9.


I will be using these for chairs and or spacers for the house and pool. Very cheap and almost idiot proof when using
Attachments
Standard Chairs and Spacers.JPG
Concrete Pad - Beam underside Chair.JPG
Plastic - Footing & Beam Reo Chair-Spacer.JPG
Plastic - Circular Column Reo Cover Spacer 5569 (Small).JPG
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Re: Another Swimming Pool Build

Postby schuimpge » Mon Jan 07, 2013 1:54 pm

Steve, I like your pool, looks great.

What I was wondering, why would you poor the pool in 2 stages?
To me, a continuous 1x poor would avoid trouble in leaking.

You just put up the forms for the walls (with clearance at the inside bottom of the forms for the base of the pool) and start poor of the concrete in them.
Have to make sure the mix is not too wet, but what leaks from under the forms on the bottom part of the pool is then added up with more concrete to bring the bottom up. I've seen that done on several very large pond and fish-tank builds. Works every time. No seams to worry about.

Cheers,
Luc
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