Bore Hole and House Supply

Anything to do with the subject of water or plumbing. Any type of well (hand dug wells, drilled wells, etc.), plumbing (but not swimming pools) or any other discussion related to water.

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Re: Bore Hole and House Supply

Postby Mike Judd » Fri Sep 05, 2014 6:20 am

Sorry about that, when I say a big tank I mean the tank in the Instantaneous heater, some have a small copper one when you look inside the unit , the larger powered ones have a corresponding larger one with a bigger element to supply multiple taps.? The P.P.-R pipes are a bit confusing with their sizes as their bore or I.D. is reduced so much with their very thick walls ,especially with the different types, red striped/white striped. Mike.
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Re: Bore Hole and House Supply

Postby arranp » Sun Feb 01, 2015 12:32 pm

Sometimewoodworker wrote:
Roger Ramjet wrote:
Sometimewoodworker wrote:The other point is that usually stored hot water systems are not pressurised. They have their own stop valve and a pressure relief system so that the hot water can expand. However if yours is pressurised then the hot water pressure will fluctuate in line with the cold so again there would not be any change in temperature.

I was told, because there is no relief valve in sight that the Eltron is pressurised and has electronic safety cut-off inbuilt. It can be adjusted for temperature required by taking down the bottom plate. I think it's a PSH100-SI. I'd have to look at the manual to be sure. I bought it because it said it conformed to all EU standards of safety. It's also very cheap to run and requires only 1 mm wiring.
The reason I bought the Mitsubishi pump was to service the whole house, pool and garden. For what it's worth its done the job well. I also needed a lift pump because it is mounted on the wall two metres above ground level.
But, I am no pump expert, or hot water heater expert, so I just went with what was recommended.

Now I'm totally confused. The picture you showed in your build is a Hitachi WT-P400GX. Did you change that one.

However for information for others both the shallow well pumps and the constant pressure pumps can be mounted above the level of the water supply. The shallow well pumps (Mitsubishi WP and Hitachi WT) can suck from about a maximum of 7 to 8 metres and pump to about 20 metres. The constant pressure pumps lift from 6 to 8 meters and pump to about 18 metres.

image.jpg



image.jpg



to help my understanding, the WT-P400GX gives "suction lift" as 8m and "discharge head" 20m. Does this mean the pump can be no higher than 8m above the base of the water tank, and will pump water to max of 20m from the pump, and the water will come out of the shower at 56 litres per minute given sufficiently large pipe for example 35mm. ? and it consmes 400 watts of electric per hour.

shower head level - 52 litres of water per minute
( 20m )
pump level
( 8m )
water tank level
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Re: Bore Hole and House Supply

Postby Ians » Sun Feb 01, 2015 1:30 pm

Suction lift denotes the maximum "lift" from water level below the pump centreline at sea level that the particular pump is capable of achieving. The discharge head is the head the pump can achieve (in layman's terms can "pump to") So for the pump you are discussing it can lift upto 8m vertical distance and deliver a flow of X litres / sec or minute. Discharge head and flow are inter-related as head increases flow reduces.

Even if the pump is capable of delivering 56 l/m to the shower outlet point ------- the flow thru the shower will be a lot less than 56 l -- WHY because the shower nozzle acts as an increased head the pump sees and the flow will reduce with an increase in pressure (no different than closing a tap or adjusting the nozzle on your garden hose from a soft gentle spray to a jet stream.)

For your interest, there are hundreds of sites on the internet when you can read up and study basic pump theory.
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Re: Bore Hole and House Supply

Postby Sometimewoodworker » Sun Feb 01, 2015 1:55 pm

arranp wrote:to help my understanding, the WT-P400GX gives "suction lift" as 8m and "discharge head" 20m. Does this mean the pump can be no higher than 8m above the base of the water tank, and will pump water to max of 20m from the pump, and the water will come out of the shower at 56 litres per minute given sufficiently large pipe for example 35mm. ? and it consmes 400 watts of electric per hour.

shower head level - 52 litres of water per minute
( 20m )
pump level
( 8m )
water tank level


No. RTFM.
The flow of 52 lpm is at 12 metres hight above the pump. And the 20m is hight above the pump not distance from the pump.
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Re: Bore Hole and House Supply

Postby arranp » Sun Feb 01, 2015 2:54 pm

what is RTFM?

igot it i did read the manual hence the question.
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Re: Bore Hole and House Supply

Postby arranp » Sun Feb 01, 2015 3:00 pm

i see it.

any idea how to work out the discharge capacity 20m above the pump?
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Re: Bore Hole and House Supply

Postby Sometimewoodworker » Sun Feb 01, 2015 4:26 pm

arranp wrote:i see it.

any idea how to work out the discharge capacity 20m above the pump?

Buy a Mitsubishi. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Their table is more helpful and in the same post.

R read T the F friendly M manual

Is the polite version, if you are unhappy then there's an obvious substitute for friendly
However I am always polite. :? :wink:

arranp wrote:igot it i did read the manual hence the question.
clearly you didn't because the figures are in my posted pictures.
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Re: Bore Hole and House Supply

Postby kmanonmaui » Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:28 pm

Sometimewoodworker wrote:Welcome Mikos

My opinion, and the way we will build, is that the well pump should feed at least 1 tank at a high enough elevation to supply water when the power is off. In our village this happens almost every time it rains and there are power cuts of up to 4 hours at other random times.

Some will claim that a pressure tank will be enough and if you have a good power supply it may be, we don't so for us it isn't.

Our plan is to have a small, 500 litre may be, tank just under the roof. This should be enough to feed the toilets and washing up water it may even provide a low power shower on the ground floor. We are going to look into a low voltage solar powered water pump to help the pressure.


Hello yet again. Now I'm on to water as I'm sure you can see. So, we plan on a bore well, pump and also a generator as putting a water tank high enough to give us adequate pressure is not what we want to do (though I did investigate this option earlier on). Since we will have a decent sized generated, setup for easy or automatic switch over.

On a side topic (hot water) my plan is to install a large gas "on-demand" heater on the exterior of the house (covered and sitting on its own raised pad) so that hot water can be run to all faucets and showers in the house rather than putting an on-demand electric heater in each shower/sink that we want. Sorry, used to washing dishes and hands with hot water, so that is kind of a must for us.

Question: Do you think my plan is stupid, and if so, why and what do you suggest differently?

Thanks in advance,
-k-
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